12/8/16 MSOP Meeting Minutes

Present: Bonnie Wold, Tim Lokensgard, Jessica Miller, Tim Headlee, Eric Hesse, Mike Homer, JoAnn Holton, Crystal Kreklow

AFSCME Agenda Items


AFSCME introduced Crystal Kreklow as our new field representative from Council 5.


Follow Up:

  1. Rec/Visit / PX1S / Transport Staffing-

    Eric brought up the proposal that was discussed at a meeting with labor and management regarding Rec/Visit and Pexton 1 South staffing. The proposal was that the Pexton Social Center would become an open movement area, such as the Outer Yard is, and the three staff during the evening for Rec/Visit would be assigned as follows: 1 for Activity Building, 1 for Visit, and 1 Rover to float between Pexton 1 South to help with escorts, do a round through Social and Outer Yard, and to staff Social if a vulnerable adult or a client on an escort plan wanted to attend Social. Eric stated that he had talked to some of the staff on both sides, but not all, and wanted to give an update on the status of what he is hearing. He stated that everyone he had talked to is not liking the proposal of Social Center being open movement since there seems to be a lot of issues at Social that are solved by staff and it would create less opportunity for people on an escort plan to attend Social. Also, they felt that if the rover staff was to sit social if an escorted client wanted to attend, they would be doing that all the time since there some clients who are on such plans that are at Social a lot. The feeling would be that the three staff would be as follows: 1 for Activity Building, 1 for Social Center, and 1 person that would help Pexton 1 South with escorts and sit visits if needed. Tim Lokensgard stated that sounded reasonable. Eric said he would talk with the remainder of the staff and get back to Tim about what they are feeling.


    Eric then brought up that staff on Pexton 1 South during 2nd Watch are feeling that they are short as well and that they feel they are the first unit to get pulled a staff if a need arises. Eric brought up that this would essentially move the unit to one staff since one has to be with the 1 to 1 client and that would leave no one for the escorts. Tim stated he would look into this.


    Eric then talked about an add-on item regarding staffing. He stated the Transport Team feels that they are very short staff, especially now that one of their staff got temporarily reassigned to CPS Outings Post. Mike stated that they do need more staff there since there is a lot of transports and sometimes people get pulled to do transports. Tim stated that he is unsure if he could backfill and reassign someone for this from someone who works 8 hour shifts to put them on 10 hour shifts and not have to pay them overtime for the two hours. He stated he will look into this and get back to us.

New Agenda Items:


  1. Holiday Pay Codes – Eric asked why all the changes to this. Bonnie stated that it was a DHS level decision and that they are working on improving the codes. Eric brought up that the old codes and the old cheat sheet that was made had allowed staff to place 12 hours into vacation and comp time if wanted. Eric stated that the contract hasn’t changed on this. Bonnie said they were aware of the issues and are working on them. JoAnn asked who was the one that made the decision to change it and Bonnie stated it was MMB. Eric stated that the feeling amongst the membership is that it wasn’t broke so why try to change it.

  2. PX1S Bodily Fluids – Eric stated that recently staff on Pexton 1 South were having to measure urine from one of the clients for medical reasons and felt that this was not a security duty, but a Health Services duty. Eric stated that they were told they were to look at the level and document due to being told that Health Services was short on staff and was unable to do so. Staff then went to their supervisor and the decision was made that the client would self-report the level to staff. Eric stated that this may cause an issue due to the client being a vulnerable adult and if the client misrepresents the self-report, staff may get into trouble. Bonnie stated that it was only staff looking at the level of the urine, not having to physically touch the container with the urine inside of it. She stated that this would be no different than if a client were to go on a hunger strike and staff would have to document how much food was being eaten by the client. Bonnie said it would be dependent on the medications if staff would not be asked to do it. Both sides agreed that the communication needed to be improved and the reason why it was needed to be done needed to be clearer.

  3. CPS clients calling staff phones – Eric brought up that some staff are uncomfortable with CPS clients being able to call them on staff phones, such as asking to pass on a message or with the most recent instance being a client calling Shantz Control to reserve the Arousal Management Room. Tim Lokensgard stated he had talked to Tim Benesch regarding this since he was unable to attend this meeting and he will be addressing the issue of it with the clients and it is going to be limited to those that are close to getting their provisional discharge. Kelly Meyer will be addressing the issue of the Arousal Management Room with the clients and following up with them on the procedure.

  4. Investigation with Direct Supervisor – Eric said that he is still hearing that an employee’s direct supervisor is sitting on investigations. We feel like this is a conflict of interest due to them already making up their mind in the investigatory process if we grieve the discipline to them. Eric brought up that Forensics is in the practice of not having the direct supervisor sit the investigations. Bonnie stated that the direct supervisor is not directly involved in the discipline process and what level of discipline issued. Eric stated he understands that, but they are the one who comes up with the summary of findings in the investigation report and make up their mind if the allegation is substantiated or not, thus making it hard to present the 1st step grievance to the direct supervisor because they have already made up their mind. Tim Headlee stated there are issues of level of trust already with an employee and their supervisor. Bonnie stated that she hears what we are saying but some have good relationships with their supervisor. She can see both sides and will reassign who does the investigation if there is a conflict of interest. Tim asked what about the grievance procedure and Jessica responded that it was a DHS/MMB decision to have it this way.

  5. Hospital Advanced OT – Eric stated that members have been asking if hospital coverage outside of 25 miles (Cities/Rochester) could be given out as advanced overtime, giving them the ability to plan ahead of time, such as bringing a meal or money for a meal. Tim Lokensgard stated it was decided that the overtime would be at the end of the shift (subsequent). They have had it the other way where someone would come in 2 hours before the start of the shift and stay 2 hours afterwards, but they ran into problems if someone called in sick or didn’t show up. Eric stated that’s fine if they want the overtime at the end of the shift, but it could still be given out in advance. Tim brought up a scenario that if someone got the advanced overtime for the end of the shift, then went to the hospital, two less senior staff signed up for subsequent shift for the next shift and got it, then the hospital coverage ended halfway through the shift and the people came back but missed out on the overtime, then it would be grieved. Eric stated that the subsequent shift overtime could be cancelled due to two people already getting advanced since it is management’s right to cancel overtime if the need isn’t needed anymore. Tim stated that this is how it’s going to be done and Bonnie stated if any staff have any questions regarding this, they can e-mail Tim Lokensgard.

  6. Lighting in Parking Lots – Eric stated there are staff that would like to have more lighting in the parking lots since it is pretty dark in some areas at night. He also stated there is some wondering if there could be more parking areas. Bonnie stated that they are working on it and a proposal was made to add more lighting, parking and cameras, but they are awaiting approval. Tim Headlee asked about Campus Security once MSOP takes over lower campus. Bonnie said there is also a proposal in to have MSOP have their own Campus Security.

  7. Computers in Break Rooms – Eric asked if there could be computers in the break rooms so staff can access the internet on their breaks. Bonnie stated that they have some money in the budget for more computers, but break rooms are not the priority. The priority for computers are those that are in need of new ones. Bonnie stated that there are areas for staff to use computers and listed Stacy Sonnek’s office, Stacey Michels’ office, Tammy Holmes’ office, and in the visit office in the Pexton Lobby for Pexton, the A-Team office and Transport office for Shantz, and the Activity Building Training Room as areas that staff can use. Eric brought up that using people’s personal office could lead to a problem if something ends up missing or if the staff whose office we’re using has something out that people are not supposed to see that could lead to a HIPAA violation. Bonnie stated that it’s the staff’s responsibility to lock up any personal items or files in their office.

  8. 2nd Watch bump to 1st Watch – Eric brought up the recent announcement that was asking for volunteers to go to 1st Watch from 2nd Watch and if no volunteers, the least senior would be bumped to 1st Watch. Eric asked why it was only 2nd Watch since they have the most people out on work out of classes and there are inverses to 2nd Watch. Tim Lokensgard stated that at the time they were looking to do this, 2nd Watch was fully staffed and 3rd Watch was getting the most overtime due to inversing into 1st Watch. Tim then said that this is no longer needed due to them moving people that were hired to 1st Watch to 1st Watch. Mike stated there was a perception that it was going to be a permanent bump. Tim said it was only going to be temporary.

  9. No SNV for mid-shifts – Eric stated that people coming in at 8am are being told that they cannot get SNV since it is given out prior to them coming in and they need to be present to sign up for SNV. Eric asked why this is being done because they have the right to short notice as long as there isn’t a need for them that would go past 2:30pm. Also, if they are going to hand it out before they show up, they could at least save one spot for them in case. Eric also brought up that one OD is saying they can call before their shift starts to sign up, and one OD is saying they have to be present in order to sign up. Tim Lokensgard stated that short-notice should be only given out and the numbers pulled at the time they can be let go. Tim also said the mid-shifts should be able to sign up and if given before their shift, they can call beforehand to sign up. Tim will follow up with the ODs regarding this.

  10. Joint Meet and Confers - frequency and dates for 2017 – Eric asked if Joint Meet and Confers with Local 1092 out of Moose Lake could be more frequent. We had agreed to go to twice a year, but would like to see if we could at least go back to how it was (three times a year) since both sides (404 and 1092) feel that it is beneficial to have the joint meet and confers. Eric also said with talks with Moose Lake that HR has the dates for 2017 already set, with February being the next one. Jessica stated that she had talk with Zack Sowieja out of Moose Lake HR and the dates are February and August. Eric stated that this is fine, but we would still like more of them. Bonnie stated that she will talk with Moose Lake management regarding this. Eric then asked if they are still in the stance of us meeting in St. Paul as long as the joint agenda merited it. Bonnie stated that both sides did not want to sit through both individual agendas, since sometimes St. Peter would have more agenda items than Moose Lake that were site-specific. Eric stated that sometime when we have a site-specific topic, both sites could benefit from it. Bonnie stated that that could be talked about on our end when talking about each agendas amongst the local unions. Bonnie stated she will also talk with Moose Lake management regarding this and Jessica added that it was agreed upon that the joint meet and confer agenda would need to be in 2 weeks in advance if a St. Paul meeting would be warranted.

  11. MoA’s for 2nd Watch positions – Eric stated that recently a 2nd Watch position was given to an outside hire instead of agreeing to open it up for a current employee as previously done. Eric asked if we are no longer doing this. Tim Lokensgard stated that they thought since the position was a 5/2 rotation with Tuesdays and Wednesdays off that it wouldn’t be desirable. Eric stated that by the response that he had gotten, it is desirable and a lot of members want to work 2nd Watch. Tim stated that with all the overtime that was occurring, they just need to get the vacancy filled. Tim Headlee stated that he had heard that the position went to an employee’s relative and that people could see that as favoritism. Management and HR stated that they were unaware that this had happened, but could see that, but assured that this wasn’t the case. Tim Lokensgard then stated that they will look at each position individually and may not do it for every position that opens up. Eric asked that the union could at least be in on the discussion beforehand and Tim agreed.

  12. Advanced OT distribution – Eric brought up that some OD’s are assigning overtime in advance in ways that could lead to issues. Eric stated that say 4 spots were available. The most senior person was coming in for the next shift, so the OD would wait to ask them until they came in, but would offer the next 3 spots to the next three most senior people. Eric stated that the top person is still getting the overtime, but it could leave room for a lot of mistakes, such as if the OD forgets or if something happens that they quit assigning overtime. Tim Lokensgard agreed and it is not supposed to be happening this way. The ODs are supposed to wait to call until the shift is already rolling to hand out advanced overtime. Tim will address this with the ODs.

  13. Military Leave ETL (Add-On) – Tim Headlee stated that some people in Forensics are running out of their 15 days of Military Leave and then are being told they have to use ETL, but are not getting their accruals and then would then have to send an e-mail to get their accruals back. Eric stated there is the same issue in MSOP, but they were told that if they use ETL, they would not be getting their accruals. Jessica stated that they are working on a solution and thought it was fixed where they would get their accruals, but will look into it and let us know.




AFSCME gave management the calendar for 2017 with dates of meetings, conventions, etc. Eric stated that on January 27th, we will be having the State Negotiations Assembly. Jessica stated to give her and JR Haller the list of delegates for MSOP to get them the day off for it.


Management Agenda Items:


  1. Contact Number for Overtime – Tim Lokensgard stated that there has been issues with staff not getting called for overtime since they are in-building. Tim talked to Moose Lake and they are practicing where if you’re in the building and are signed up for advanced overtime, you would go into your contact information in the scheduling program and change your number to the work phone number. Crystal asked why they couldn’t just look at attendance to see if the individual is on-duty instead of having them change the number. Eric stated that then they would have to change it back afterwards to their personal number and could create problems if they forget. Tim stated that the ODs should be looking to see if anybody is on-site, but would still like them to change the number in the scheduling program.

  2. Staff (Add-On) – Bonnie stated that they just got approved to budget for three additional security counselors, but are not sure where they will be or which watch they will go to.

  3. Bricks and Mortar (Add-On) – Bonnie brought up as an awareness that they have heard that some staff have been questioning and not receptive to an activity called Bricks and Mortar where at TC group they would sit and circle and the person on your left would say something positive about you. Bonnie stated that this isn’t meant to be a boundary crossing, such as “I find you attractive”, but more of a therapeutic positive. Bonnie stated that they wanted to get this out since it may be done again on another unit and if there is any boundary crossings, that clinical would address them with the client.