July 2018 MSH Meet and Confer

AFSCME Labor Management Agenda

July 19, 2018

Administration Building MOJ



Attendance: Adam Castle, Steve Wilking, Emilio Florez, Marvin Sullivan, Alli Kuhlman, Michelle Chalin, Carol Olsen, Scott Melby, Denise Considine, Lisa Vanderveen


Reflection/Celebration: Carol-first family night went well 110 families. Seemed excited to be there. Wellness committee wanted to try this and may do more. MSOP may do the same at some point. Melby-started demo of east side of building.


Standing Items

  1. OSHA Information-Alli Kuhlman Handout
  2. Overtime Information-Alli Kuhlman Handout-Atlas hasn’t allowed to get reports out of it yet but will be soon. Marvin-a few night staff has said they have felt the inverses. Melby-We are having between 10 and 15 per day. It hasn’t been as heavy as the past. Problematic when there is a lot of inversing but there is overtime. Nursing home has quite a bit. Few on 1 to 1. Staff are picking it up but has increased.

Old Business


  1. Two Way Radio Update: Carol-They are working hard on it. Quick update they seem to be working on man down and seems to be working. Emilio-they think it will be up and running soon. Carol-Everyone has come together with bearcom with new computer if needed. Entire new console may be installed. Will be an update at then end of the night. Steve-will we be doing any testing to ensure? Carol-Brian and Dan and tom R have been doing a ton of it, so yes. You have come forward with 6 names. Go to them for tests and then let us know. Tell them to test all 3 shifts and give us the good and the bad. Emilio-people don’t know we don’t have a system in the control center right now. They are working without the system so we don’t hear man downs. We are only able to use the two way radios. Carol-that is getting looked at today. Melby-I am hesitant to tell everyone it is working on a Thursday or Friday. Let’s wait until next Monday or Tuesday so we can do some additional testing. No one wants to think its working and then find out its not.
  2. NOC Vacation and Overtime: Melby-we have contract language that says something about if you have vacation on a day that you aren’t eligible for overtime. I don’t care who gets it, but seems to be disagreement on who is eligible. If you work Tuesday night but have vacation the next day, do you have ability to get the overtime. I know this was supplemental language. Steve-most have been the day shift. We believe atlas is doing it right. Are problems on the noc shift? I will say we don’t get paid for the Christmas Eve on 24th, but when they come in at 9pm they are getting vacation. Let’s use that same practice. If puts in for 9 on Wednesday, he shouldn’t come in on Thursday till late shift. Because most of the hours fall on that day. Denise-I agree. Emilio-we met at a meet and confer on this. Since then we had times it went either way. Staff want clarification on decision and can you set a deadline. Carol-we want to agree here as Steve stated. Steve-I agree but I want the president and vice president to be here. I don’t want to make that etched decision today. I will have a conversation with them first. Denise-it’s tied to how it’s entered on day for time entry. You have vacation on a day you can’t have overtime on that day…..is it different? Carol-lets say pay period ends on Tuesday timesheet is am pm and noc is reflected on that day so that’s different. Steve-forget time sheet and go with contract. Time entry is a hiccup and shouldn’t supersede contract. We need to figure out how to enter on time sheet. Marvin-depending how you reference it, is what is confusing. Denise-I misunderstood. You are correct contractually it is the majority of what the time falls. Carol-so majority of what the day is. Scott-we can revisit after you guys talk about it. I want to make sure there is consensus with all 3 shifts. We can provide consistency. Your members want consistency. We can provide that if we have an agreement. Denise- I don’t want to see people excluded from both noc shifts. Scott-we can come up with something before next meeting to make sure we are on the same page.


  1. Forensic Nursing Home NOC Shift Change: chalin-no change at nursing home, we were discussing a potential change. We decided not to do it. We are not starting at midnight. We were having a preliminary discussion and a newer supervisor mentioned it to staff for input but then we decided not to. Marvin-msh side. Are we changing to different shifts on days? On vacation calendar shows what shift you are on. August it says 8.5 hours. I said I would bring it up. Scott-not doing any work on half hour duty free breaks. It could be a software thing. I am looking at cascading shift start times and its complications for staff. Mostly forgetting when they are supposed to be to work.  No. ill check in with Jodi to see why that’s happening.
  2. Sarah-nursing home getting new staff communication called vocera. Same as mayo with the mics. The system rolled out in cbhh statewide and CCRP was going to but decided against it. Have that for internal communication and figure out how to utilize ICS radios. Probably similar to when we used walkie talkies. Probably mid October. Will help to limit the small chatter. Carol-this system was available so we don’t need to do the separate channel anymore. Person to person instead of broadly. Anoka rolled it out and issue was it runs off Wi-Fi and had to add the boxes across the building but they like it.

New Business

Management: None


  1. Aspen Infection Control Visit/Meeting: Steve-asked to bring up infectious control and things we could improve and things being more local and centralized for easier access. Carol-there was a meeting with aspen team to help protect better. Location of PPE isn’t convenient for them. 2 to 1 concerns. Encourage them to put PPE in back pocket. They say it’s bulky. We are exploring other options for body proof gloves. Brought in behavior support team to help minimize his response. Steve-talked about preventative medicines? Carol-yes, some of them said that individual is under preventative medicine on his own and does decrease the risk. If staff is exposed. Do what you need to protect yourself. His HIV is being treated. He goes every 6 months to support the HIV inhibition. We should always consider everyone to be infectious. Take your time putting on your PPE. Steve-concern was the spontaneous outbursts. You don’t have time. Melby-important to not with him. He does not initiate his behavior towards staff. It is against peers. Staff intervene and then exposure occurs. Take your time. Staff put equipment on, that in itself escalated the situation. It’s always been after it kicked off. Don’t go in until there are proper numbers and have on the equipment to intervene. Carol-if people think we need different equipment, we are open to that. Marvin-there are nitrile gloves that are needle proof. Has that been researched? Melby-I don’t know but worth looking at. Carol-send message to tom Roessler.
  2. Intermittent Scheduling: Steve-ties in with add on. Nursing intermittent being scheduled a patterned shift. Certain days off etc. intermittents are there to fill in, not specifically a schedule. Marvin-I heard that when she started that she was told to stay on weekend rotation superficially by supervisor. Steve-add on. Intermittents in MSH are no longer to work until training up to do on TSS classes? I haven’t had time to get into specifics on agreeing to work shifts but next TSS is next Thursday so if they are being taken off the schedule. They are basically being disciplined without being disciplined. When they agree to a schedule and then changes in 14 days. Are intermittents being removed until training? Have they been removed from schedule in 14 days? Why wait until next Thursday? Carol-just became aware. I have to look at it myself still. How we learned was that an incident occurs with licensing, we do internal review and licensing wants to know all about the training. One individual was not up to date. Supervisor made decision to protect him and us. I need to take more of a look at that. As an organization we have to look at how we do our training annually and what does annually mean? We may not always get training done in 12 months. Steve-and some aren’t offered more than once a month. If they were removed within 14 days. Carol-ill do some follow up on this. Scheduled shifts and may need to correct it. Marvin-other places have abilities to set alerts for upcoming trainings. Carol-we all get alerts for cpts and others. Staff are getting them. Marvin-maybe different for intermittents? Steve-I don’t know what the case is. A common occurrence is in some places. The supervisors schedule the trainings. If some sups do this regularly then the sup changes. Staff may be accustomed to that. Carol-I can see that. I have to make a decision before end of today. One is scheduled tonight. I will talk with Alli some more and get back to you. It was to protect because of licensing. They expect us to take action.
  3. Vacation date/time stamp Atlas: Steve-currently we are trying to take preventative action for grievances. A lot of people are looking at it and wondering why they aren’t getting vacation opposed to others. I send a lot of messages to Jodi. On our screen we get only our own information why we were denied. Requesting that under name section can we get a date and time stamp? Ryan had sent some inquiries. Scott-if we do it does that tell you what you need to know? Steve-yes. Then I can just ask when that staff was approved so I know. Carol-you brought it to Jodi and they are working on it? Marvin-yeah it was a while ago. There is a way to tell. Steve-individually great but we can’t see as a whole for date and time. Marvin-she was looking to see if atlas would change it for her. Could see this on schedule anywhere.
  4. Overtime Rescinding: Steve-can we get understanding when we can do it? Some ODs say different things. Scott-where do you get that from? Steve-past practice? Scott-I don’t believe that staff should be able to rescind an overtime shift. I expect ODs to tell the staff you aren’t allowed. I do know that things come up. But they get that shift and it becomes assigned. When they rescind it, it creates complications and then may make an error with giving it to someone else. You don’t have a contractual right to do that. It’s almost like punishing us when they are rescinding it. We will deal with it when it happens with that staff and deal with them. Carol-we have had this conversation for 6 years. When accepted, it’s yours. We haven’t taken sick time for it. Scott-it’s a commitment, we will hold you to that. If you are refusing to work it, there has to be a good reason for it. Emilio-its still happening both ways. Steve-president and vice president believe you can rescind the overtime. May be discussion in the future. Carol-either way we need to have them part of the discussion. Scott-I’m trying to do this correctly and avoid the game playing. People have played games and people have done this for legit reasons as well.
  5. Kitchen Supervisor not offering OT per contract: Marvin-overtime issues assigning OT. Staff had Friday Saturday off. Picked up shift of OT. Was overheard complaining about doing the overtime. The supervisor overheard it and then admitted he did not call that staff the next time because of that. That is in violation of the contract. Carol-thanks for letting me know.
  6. Intermittent Training-covered above under intermittents.

Carol-in Sunday communication I talked about holding each other accountable and respectful. What are the responses? Steve-surprised and didn’t know it was happening. They feel the same way we do about these concerns. When you see some of the things happening in trail cam and come up with own ideas. Then you hear this stuff, ok I understand why. A lot of surprise, who was it? Carol-we are going to stay with this is state property. When we have to figure out what is going on, we have to use cameras. Emilio-I was notified no one knew it was there. ODs and everyone. Working security first thing you wanna do is write a report. Whether the reasons for it. We need to do our job. Carol-lessons learned but everyone handled it really well. Steve-we talked about how we could have handles that. Carol-one things was they were surprised I put in criminal activity involving law enforcement. It means at times there is criminal activity occurring and will turn that over to law enforcement. In last 4 weeks we have had someone go in and mess with boiler chiller room and shutting things down. It could cause thousands of damage. Had staff go into restroom on spruce. Left purse and 160 was gone. Had nasty note left in breakroom that was threatening. We shouldn’t have to worry about that stuff. Melby-I have had staff ask me about cameras being installed and no we are not. I know it’s frustrating but we are not putting in bathrooms entrance or breakrooms. Important that feedback is appalled. We wouldn’t generalize this to everyone. Everyone is appalled. Anything you can do or if you see something, say something. You can avert these if you know about them better than we can. Carol-hopefully knowledge is power and holding each other accountable. We can all change the culture.


Adjourned at 130pm