January 2020 FMHP Meeting Minutes

AFSCME Labor Management MSH

January 16, 2020 1230PM

Administration Building


Attendance: Adam Castle, Emilio Florez, Ryan Cates, Steve Wilking, Lisa Vanderveen, Crystal Kreklow, Denise Considine, Scott Melby, Roxanne Portner, Michelle Chalin, Marvin Sullivan, Jodi Seaquist, Elizabeth Trandum


Reflection/Celebration: Scott-overtime has been down the last couple of pay periods. Less overtime is less inversing.

Standing Agenda Items:

  1. OSHA Information-Handouts from Elizabeth.

  2. Overtime Information-Handouts from Elizabeth.

Old Business


  1. Vacation Requests greater than 6 months out- Cates-issue was allowing to open up and then rescind. Which opens it up. Jodi-as long as you have the accruals, you can ask for approval. Cates-so not before it’s approved? Jodi-correct. It doesn’t open up until it’s approved. Everyone seems to know the process now but I will keep looking into atlas. Once it’s approved you can do what you want. There isn’t piggy backing, but there is cherry picking. Example-someone comes and asks for some days within someone else’s request. We are not doing it where you can add on to the end of someone else’s request. Unless-one of those days falls within the 6 month and beyond the 6 months, you can request that. Feel free to call scheduling and they can help you.

  2. Scheduling Concerns of being switched to an early/late on opposite week- Jodi-it occurs sometimes. We are trying to balance the units and program. Emilio-if an employee prefers something can they request it? Jodi-we used to but then we get fallback when it doesn’t happen. They can mutual into it if they want. Marvin-people get switched to a late on their early week. Then puts us up on one shift and short on another. Now you are backfilling on their unit. Jodi-we shouldn’t be doing that. Direction is to balance the unit. If you have an extra, maybe we would change it. But there are a lot of variables.

  3. Security Company/OT- Scott-last time we met you said you don’t want us to contact the company first. We aren’t and it didn’t happen this month.

  4. OSHA Recordable Abbreviation for Patient- We are going to work on getting that fixed and watch it. Liz-PAT does stand for patient at this time.



  1. 15 Minute Wellness checks on high acuity units- Lisa-we looked at it and reevaluated. Talked with executive team. It is beneficial. It helps to prevent incidents and keep staff on unit. Keeping an appropriate level at using that time. Not changing it. Roxanne-in policy it is expanding as piloted. Marvin-round sheet is going back to old sheet but with more information.

  2. SIP Process for Nursing- Cates-Shawn was looking at it? Roxanne-no update but I need to check in with him. Idea is a standardized process. Scott-in general, we have a team working on it. They will reach out to LPN and MNA to get input on different processes. AODS will look into it. Goal is for a standard process for each area to limit inconsistencies. Not done yet.

  3. Aspen Unit Dissolution- Lisa-Thinking mid-February but hope to have more info out real soon in next week. Hinging on bedding license and taking ownership. TC has a plan in place. Opening of oak will be first thing that takes place.

New Business



  1. W-4 Change- Denise-There were changes for staff changing deductions in self-service. Staff can still do it but not as simple. Now you have to complete a form. Then goes to IRS and they calculate it. More complex than before. We don’t know a lot about it. If we hear more we will let you know. MMB memo came out and said call the IRS with questions. Steve-where is the memo? Crystal-we will attach memo to minutes. Marvin-people are confused. Who do they talk to? Crystal-it says to contact Jennifer Gotson? Denise-call the IRS.

  2. Two Supervisors Talking to Members about issues/Intimidation- Cates-specifically for nursing. If you have a problem just talking to a member, they have two sups. It’s intimidating to members. New thing that has happened. Roxanne-can you email me more info? Cates-groves and Bartlett. Cates-let us have a union rep if it happens. Crystal-if you have a witness, we need one.

  3. Supervisors, Nursing telling RN Seniors what they talk to members about- Cates-don’t talk to RN seniors about it as well because they aren’t our supervisors. Roxanne-is this specific? Cates-yes but it has happened more. Scott-things to make us aware of. We shouldn’t be sharing it with RN seniors. We can work on general guidance as well. If you bring it forward to us we will follow up to make it better. Roxanne-if it’s nursing, bring it to me. Scott-we want to hear negative feedback as well. Michelle-we have a new supervisor and we have her sit in with us on how to communicate with staff so she knows what is appropriate. Scott-you have stewards in training, we have supervisors in training. Cates-there was a nursing meeting yesterday? Apparently it got hostile.

  4. Utility Pool Dialysis Trip Issues- Cates-forced OT that violates contract. Goes until 430 minimum but putting 8 to 4 staff. Some ODs considered inverses. If you send someone on these that know it will be overtime, it should be by seniority. Scott-if someone works passed their shift, it is inverse. Sometimes someone says yeah, I’ll do it and don’t put it down. The staff we send depends on what is going on in facility. Cates-if you know they will be inverse, send based on seniority. Scott-an 8 to 4 or 7 to 3. Cates-it’s a scheduling issue if you know it ahead of time. It’s going to be an inverse. Transport might help. Scott-I will need to do some work on this. Cates-only one staff being sent. Need two for breaks etc. Scott-we have had nursing home staff for years with one staff. Cates-person can’t take a break. Scott-we are there for transportation.

    Not the same as hospital coverage. Cates-so we don’t have to be there then because they are hooked up? Scott-well, be near. We don’t want you running to McDonalds. Marvin-what if something happens? Cates-then they get coached on it.  Scott-they can go to the bathroom. We need to be professional in the public. I also struggle to think when someone is attached to dialysis that we can’t go to the bathroom. If someone says they go to the bathroom, I will understand that. I need to work on this. We will inverse for it then someone will say why do I need to be here? Steve-is there a policy? Scott-no. Steve-medicals for outside perimeter… If we can reflect it in policy instead, I want to see it in policy so I can say “well policy states.” I want it to reflect what you are saying. Marvin-I stick to my policy which says monitored the whole time. Roxanne-could be patients on dialysis where circumstances are different. Scott-call AOD if you have questions on these trips. We have had increases in these appointments.

  5. Incentive MOU 2020- Cates-Education and topped out. Denise-Referral bonus is being paid out and hasn’t stopped. Recruitment incentive is being looked at for hard to fill positions. LPNs automatically but others are case by case. Student loan reimbursement will be reviewed later in fiscal year. Issues last year that had a large number then didn’t submit the paperwork within the 30 days. So we now have to recoup that money. Retention bonus is not being discussed right now. Crystal-overtime bonus besides LPNs? Denise-No, some supplementals have their own. Case by case again.

  6. Inconsistency on what last shift pay period is for inversing- Jodi-we were able to correct that this week. Will count on Tuesday night. If person gets inversed overnight until Wednesday, it counts for the previous pay period. Let me know if that is not happening.

  7. Security Services treated like utility pool/Overtime Distribution- Emilio-someone signed up for overtime on an early. Need is at 9 for OT. Supervisor called the person and offered the shift because they were extra. We lost one of our staff. Then went to do overtime. Then cancelled hers into the late shift. Are extras going to be used like that? Some staff don’t have the qualifications for residential. Scott-event or practice? Cates-both. Will you pull them from SS to use as residential? Scott-we might as long as capable and qualified. Sometimes we get last minute sick calls. Tough to say security services can do overtime on units but not get inversed. Emilio-seemed like SS was left out of a lot of things. We are putting it out there for clarification. Scott-what do the supervisors say? Emilio-still looking into it. Used this process with chain of command and it never gets anywhere. Scott-this is caused by AODS office or SS supervisors? Emilio-AODS employees not in security.

  8. Subsequent shift box for Security Services- Crystal-told if you decline, they will stop contacting you, accidental clicks, performance issue? Marvin-someone was told it would be performance issue. Scott-was it an OD? Marvin-yes. Scott-I feel people were testing it out and some thought it was some sort of a protest. Did it happen another time? Emilio-not sure. Jodi-it is set up for those who have residential qualifications to sign up for both. Marvin-can you un-sign up? Jodi-I just made a note. Or even an “are you sure”. Scott-I have not directed people to do anything as far as a limit or performance issue. I believe some people were frustrated that first day but let me know if it’s happening and we will follow up. Marvin-people are just trying and then told they have it. Jodi-I will look at a prompt or rescind. Steve-I like the rescind button. I sign up and then I maybe get a call that I can’t do the overtime. Scott-I understand that. I heard some staff are self-selecting. Emilio-some less senior staff feel bullied. If they want it, take it.

  9. Emilio-Overtime on units we were to be offered if it becomes an inverse in SS. Taking away from security and giving to residential. Steve-what if I’m more senior than Emilio and I get residential OT. If there are other for SS, do I get my department first and then inverse in residential side? Or keep me residential and offer him SS side? Scott-you are presenting how you want me to answer. We aren’t interested in inversing people. This is complicated especially when AODS is working to accommodate. Emilio-we are one department. Scott-then AOD takes the expert and places them there in residential. Cates-not all AODS does this. How does this work. Scott-I can’t say that but we have to take this case by case. Emilio-only happens sometimes, not all of the time. Seems preferential.

    Scott-I believe that if it preferential it’s in seniority or in the area they work. I heard not all in department agrees on how to do things. Emilio-I’m worried the same person is getting both. Scott-we own the overtime as per contract. What is requirement for residential staff to cover SS? Scott-descriptive in department. Read and sign with the supervisor. Emilio-there is no way to sign up. Scott-residential is taken care of but not security side…Emilio-correct. Steve-what makes them not qualified is just bidding out. Asking to have the ability or if they can bid out, they are able to go back in to work. Scott-nothing we can address with add on. Scott-SS is technical and frequent changes. If we go from SS to res, it’s not as complicated. Emilio-I disagree. I could train someone in 1 day. Scott-we need to maintain competency. I have been told it’s complicated and I value it. We allow SS staff to make sure they know certain policies and practices to go back to res. To go back into SS, there are a lot of complications. I don’t want to put staff at risk where they make an error because they don’t know.

  10. Tracking Time of FSS staff in Security Services- Emilio-lots of inconsistencies. I hadn’t worked SS for 2 weeks. A key system wasn’t working properly. I couldn’t track everybody. I get called by AODS and he asks why I didn’t write down everyone. I said there are better ways to mark off. They said they want us to keep track of FSS staff for coverage needs. Why are we only doing counselor needs when there are clinical needs as well? Is it our job to keep track of staff coming in. they want us to call and tell them if someone is late, etc. Crystal-we don’t supervise our own. Not asking us to do it for anyone except for afscme. We shouldn’t be doing it. It is management responsibility. Emilio-I wasn’t even told about the system not working. Scott-we have been doing this for decades.

    About ensuring we have the resources we need to be save. The primary staff we have for keeping us safe is counselors, primary staff, and nursing. At no point did we say it’s tardy when control staff calls. It’s all to make sure we have the staff on the unit. It would only be a matter of time when we say “why don’t we use these staff to utilize these systems.” Letting us know if someone is present, isn’t out of line. Its letting us know if we need resources somewhere. Marvin-why aren’t we keeping track of everyone if it’s about safety-Scott-we aren’t keeping track. We have different ways of keeping track of nursing at shift change. Multiple areas for counselors. Marvin-keeping people safe. You want to know everyone. Scott-I want to have the resources to respond to an incident. I’m not expected to respond, I’m not a primary responder. Crystal-why are we looking at nursing staff. Scott-we are. Why are we talking about this now? We cover an entire campus. Marvin-We had lance sitting with us in Bartlett. Scott-I gave you my answer.

  11. Security Staff required to call locations when on patrol/Issues on patrol- Emilio-I see the concern. We have a list. They expect us to call out any building we get to. I don’t see the reason. They say its safety. You are bouncing around. It should be at the di 20 to discretion of the staff. Its daytime and I walk into Bartlett, I don’t see the point. Stems from certain things that happen that I don’t want to call out. When you see a supervisor playing a game in the middle of the night, I don’t want to call out. Scott-I want to know of those instances when supervisors are playing games. Steve-when I patrol, you call me to give something to someone. Admin is fully staffed. I can go in and don’t need to call that. The pavilion, I park a truck and check a building and walk back. Some unnecessary traffic. Cell phone. Some people feel sups are micromanaging listening for call outs. We are out there doing our job, we have scan points and documenting on shift log. If you have questions, look at the logs. Cates-you are triple checking. Emilio-I know it’s about safety. Steve-we want to have the option to call out but if I feel like I’m safe and I have a phone, etc. Scott-Security isn’t convenient. This person is moving alone. We have had slip and falls. If they get knocked out, the cell and radio won’t help but the last call would. This is someone in SS who is an expert with the radio system. I am comfortable with this practice. Has anyone gotten in trouble? Emilio-a supervisor has called to see if we were calling. Not in trouble yet but we can see it happening. Scott-this has been a long standing practice. Emilio-it wasn’t required, it was as discretion. Scott-Not prepared to change practice. I don’t have an answer for how many security issues have been reported in the last five years. Steve-I don’t call certain spots. I can clear that in less than 4 minutes.

    We check exterior buildings walking around campus. If I step out of patrol truck and I do summit center checking doors. Should I be radioing if I am checking the perimeter? Where does it stop? Scott-this is a position where one staff is alone on campus where we don’t have video. I am okay with these transmissions. Emilio-truck drivers, RTs are all by themselves and don’t do check ins. Scott-good point, maybe we should. Scott-this is the job for a whole shift. I’m comfortable with this. If you are out driving around and something happened on campus and OSHA comes to me. Then I have a difficult answer. I am willing to do something annoying to defend our practices. Emilio-The first time a supervisor calls to talk to me about this, I will send them to you. We talked to our supervisors. I can’t even get a meeting. Scott-I will follow up. Roxanne-how do you want to do it? Emilio-I don’t follow a routine on patrol or on the unit. Never the same routine. Call radio but be reasonable. Time of day, staffing, just some discretion. Steve-I love that. There is some micromanaging where they are listening for the call outs and calling if we don’t. Crystal-walking into highly populated in a staff area as well. I get it in an area there aren’t a lot of staff. Steve-it takes 20 minutes in one building, yeah call it in. Scott-I will take it back to them.

  12. Shift In progress for security services-

Add Ons:

  1. Transport Team-Scott-postings will go up. 6 vacant PCNs. 2 Fri/sat. 2 sat/sun. 2 sun/mon. medicals needed on Sundays too. Early shift 630 to 230. New shift 9 to 5. This is the 28 day notice. It’s different from what we said in the past. Liz-postings up tomorrow and will be 2/19/20. Cates-what if they go dead? Scott-I want people who want to be in this. I would be surprised but then it would go to new staff. My hope that this will take care of Dialysis but I can’t say utility won’t ever do it. Steve-should more transports be needed would 6 go to higher number? Scott-all areas will be assessed, if we need more we will look at the need. Steve-what about a lead? Scott-no approval for additional positions or an open lead spot. I will look at it. Marvin-campus wide. Will Bartlett take med trips? Scott-depends on situation. Some will say it’s a better idea for them to take the staff, then have transport cover the unit. It’s good to have a team because they would be consistent. We will have growing pangs. If there isn’t a lot of work for them we will use as utility post. Our schedulers will do best to schedule appointments in those timeframes.


    Meeting Adjourned at 200pm