February 2019 MSOP Meet and Confer

AFSCME MSOP Labor Management

February 28th 2019




Attendance: Adam Castle, Ryan Cates, Eric Hesse, Jamie Sheppard, Molly Kennedy, Crystal Kreklow, Michelle Sexe, Troy Sherwood, Tim Lokensgard, Denise Considine, Andrew Cole



  1. 1.      Follow Up Items
    1. A.     Inverse/Overtime Numbers- Tim: January-1st watch 16 staff for 44.75 hours. 2nd watch 7 staff for 20.75 hours. 3rd watch 5 staff for 31 hours. Overtime total 767 hours.
    2. CPS Staffing- Michelle: still trying to see what issues are. A lot of staff came to me that they don’t find they are being short. Checked with group and are still looking to see what needs to change. Hesse-sometimes picture you are getting is rosier. Michelle-they felt that was not accurate and that it is not. Hesse-2nd watch at 6an are only assigned 5 until the 6th shows up at 8am. Michelle-will have to check into that. Not a cost saving. There is movement and 5 staff. Is that confused? Hesse-no, one is being left alone until 8. Michelle-hard to believe but i will check into it. hesse-frequently. Michelle-od base staffing on what I say it needs to be.
    3. Incentive MOU- Hesse-any answers to questions from last month. Denise-maybe I can answer. Hesse-why brought out when there wasn’t money for it. Seems to only follow some parts of MOU. Topped out bonus its 6 months but you used a year. When we talked about it, it said satisfactory or better based on performance but then discipline was used. The "or higher" wouldn’t apply. Student loan we know only 100k for LPN and 100k for all others state wide only 40 LPN statewide at 2500. 40 for state wide all other job classes. How are we determining this? Denise- I don’t think. Crystal and Mel have talked about this. DCT exec team met and decided parameters so it is equal. Wasn’t MSOP determining. It was standardized. I don’t think they have determined the student loan stuff yet. We don’t know how many at what amount or anything yet. Isn’t a topic for this table? People involved here aren’t making the decisions. Hesse-but the people here can figure it out and then tell others. Crystal-he’s right. They can take it back as a follow up. The roll out isn’t being followed as negotiated and how we can alleviate that. Denise-I appreciate the concerns but only so much we can answer. it comes up and

We feel it comes up and I don’t have the authority. Kristen and Mel are having discussions. I will bring updates as I hear them. Hesse-this is appropriate avenue because it deals with moral. They are thinking they are getting something then they get nothing. Denise-we want them to be happy as well but also understand that this management team had

No role in this. Would help if there were more specific questions because you are going to get the same answer. A different level made the decision. Crystal-this level has

Has started conversation of how it changed from what we agreed to. Staff reversed decision on staff. It is proper here to get changed at another level. 

Denise-We shouldn’t minimize this. Denise-I didn’t mean to minimize. Reach out to us if you have other questions. Hesse-big question is why did it happen? Crystal have you heard anything? I know it was DCT exec team decision. Crystal-same answer as what I get but then it was they decided 1 year over 6 months. Denise-can all be interpretation. Crystal-Programs didn’t budget for incentives. We are going to have more conversation at DCT level. I agree it’s not open to interpretation. It says t6 months. Not a year. Denise-We will definitely bring updates as we get them.


 New AFSCME Items

  1. MSOP Legislative Proposal- Hesse-we are asking for 21.8 mill and 22 in second year. Only talks about cps. Maintain 85 FTE. What does maintain mean? Cates-funded or unfunded. Tim-My guess is unfunded ones. Between Moose Lake and St. Peter. 75 unfunded. Increase of 10. Hesse-maintain what we have? Denise-when cps and reintegration expanded. Those weren’t budgeted for so we shuffled them. Now trying to get funding. Frozen positions. This proposal will get those. Looks like the positions at cps weren’t budgeted so it allows for those so those come back to us. Hesse-I would like assurance not guesses. Crystal-can someone get back to us? I think that is what Eric is asking. Hesse-increase FTE by 10 in next fiscal. We heard 35. Where are these 10 going and what job class. Tim-I haven’t heard. Hesse-I would like to know it gets used properly. It was used improperly in the first place that’s why we are here. Tim-everyone here would like teh75 back. Along with the other 10. Crystal-we don’t want to lobby at capital if we don’t know where it’s going. Hesse-it talks about they had to pull from unfunded staff but doses say they will refund the positions. Tim-I can only guess it’s the 75 plus 10 I don’t know. crystal-Denise is getting answers
  2. Organizational Look Workgroup- Hesse-requesting what they did with forensics. All sides. HR, management, security, etc. Get together, look at us as a whole and are these needed? MSOP, they have 1 per 6.8 staff.  In MSH, 1 to 12.6 staff. We are the most top heavy in DHS. Something needs to change. Look at whole and ask are these right positions. Crystal-we can reach out to forensics how they did it there. Best benefit program. Stenger-one every 2 weeks. Don’t go through BMS process. Crystal-sit down and take look at org as a whole. Are we using our resources responsibly? Doesn’t appear that way. Tim-well get back to you. Crystal-who will get back to us? Troy-I can. Get me goals so I have outline what you are looking for. Crystal-I can send email to Melissa. Stenger-BMS is good but sometimes just drags out process. 
  3. Extreme Cold Staffing- Hesse-back when it was freezing. Canceling exterior rounds but had A Team out over an hour shoveling. If it was too cold to walk around but wasn’t for shoveling. Also, staff was forced to go to zone 10 to shovel when maintenance was around. Troy-both were isolated we need to look into. Other one was when I was on call. Tried MSH but no one was available. We went to making sure the emergency exits were clear. We went down the row for clients and cant due to extreme cold. I will have to look into these. Tim-did they contact OD? Hesse-it was right before meds so didn’t want that. It was getting compact. If people had mobility issues they could deliver. Troy-meds and meals were delivered. We went to health service for clients who had issues. Hesse-why did you have people out shoveling? Troy-that’s why we are looking into it. Tim-they could call the OD. Hesse-when you are told, you don’t feel comfortable. Tim-and that’s why I want to talk to the OD to see what was going on.
  4. Breaks Between Shifts- Hesse-used to be 15 min break to leave between shifts. Has stopped now? Directed not to do this? Tim-have they been open to using half hour? Hesse-can still use half hour but 3rd to 1st. you get inversed. You are stuck for next 8.5 hours. Troy-we have been through this. Troy-as long as checking in with OD. We will follow up with OD. If there isn’t a known need, we will accommodate for that. We need to be clear. The 15 min isn’t duty free. Cates-1-15 minute break every 4 hours. If you work 2 shifts it doesn’t say in contract. Tim-I assume it’s not duty free. Cates-in forensics, we do it this way.  Molly-it’s just a courtesy. Hesse-if it’s abused it can be looked at.
  5. A Team Reports and Duties- Hesse-od forcing a team members to write reports but if didn’t complete their A team duties, being forced to finish those where before it was just to write into report. Tim-I will have to follow up on that. I haven’t heard anything. Yes, do reports but haven’t heard have to do a team duties. Crystal-reach out immediately if it happens? Tim-yes. Email me so I can follow up the next day if it’s late at night. Troy-we don’t need the names but send it to me or Tim. 
  6. Job Coach/Leads- Hesse-policy that all leads have to be coaches. Caution against because some just may not be good teachers. Good at job but may not be good at teaching. Setting up trainer and trainee up for failure. Troy-consider lead a subject matter expert. We want them training. For a lead that needs to explain things on the unit...we struggle with that. Hesse-I agree. Years ago when you had to show initiative. But now just showing up you can be a lead. Years ago you were showing you can do this but now with the change you can get someone not a good fit for teaching. Troy-that’s a different topic. Tim-would you like to change the process? Cates-labor doesn’t decide on this. Employer does. Troy- I appreciate it and it will be looked at but we will require our leads to be coaches. Cates-it’s not the new staffs faiult that someone doesnt want to train. Crystal-we have seen good trainers on the unit but as soon as they have to train. They may panic and freeze. You have great leads but when you ask them to teach it could go out the window. Then it can be a performance issue. I am great at my job but suck at teaching. Molly-I get both sides. Some just don’t have the skill set. Michelle-there are also leads that don’t do any extra work. Troy-there is work to be done. Stenger-we need to include MSH if you do decide to change the lead process. Michelle-we will take it back. We do want them to be successful. Offering more training. Troy-working with Moose Lake also for job coaching. Hesse-if you do go back to old lead process....we are having difficulty now. You will get people that are more motivated. 
  7. Clothing Allowance Reduction- Hesse-allowance changed for non-perimeter staff went from 300 to 150 at cps? No one notified. Middle of fiscal year. Some got and some didn’t. We would ask that it be initiated at beginning of fiscal year. Molly-a lot of them cover a lot in perimeter. Michelle-first I have heard. I want to know why that has changed. I don’t agree with the change but can follow up.
  8. Tier 4 & 5 Activity Building Privilege /Inverses- Tier 4 and 5 Activity Building privileges-Hesse-expanded 4 and 5 to be in gym form 8 to 930. When this came up before, it was only if staff were available. Only 4 or 5 clients that utilize it. Opening up AB for those clients and inversing staff to cover it. I addressed with OD and he said it’s at our discretion. Troy-during cold weather gym was close tried to get clients out for long weekend. We talked about not having enough activities. It is OD discretion. It was to get them out to do something. We talked about safety and this was to get them out. Hesse-forcing people to stay with low attendance. Troy-we can’t predict attendance. Hesse asked and it’s usually 3 to 4. Troy-we are looking at that stuff and looking at different options. Could happen again but maybe different location. Tim-advocating for less programming if inversing staff? Stenger-tiers 4 and 5 are the better ones...Tim-I want to be clear you are asking for less programming if inversing? Stenger-yeah. Hesse-if someone was there voluntarily, fine. If I am inversed and have been there all day...I’m like boy...Troy-so send staff somewhere else and have a different staff cover? Hesse-this was supposed to be staff available. Tim-inversed until 8 and when inversed for shift. So OD said. Keep it open I want to be clear that programming will be reduced if inversed for the shift to get them out early. Hesse-yes troy-trying to find rewarding opportunities for those not having issues. Michelle-we want to encourage them to strive for that. Hesse-that’s why organizational group would be good.
  9. Atlas app update and accruals-Tim-haven’t heard anything. I will make sure DeAtley finds out where we are at. Hesse-complaints about accruals not getting in accurately from sema4. Increasing. Tim-are they working with Jaime? Hesse-yes, it’s an increasing issue. Tim-it should go and update as it happens. One bid dump. Stenger-if you put it in before that 5 days, it might get denied. Tim-it’s a 5 day delay. From end of pay period. Stenger-no cushion hours.
  10. 10.  Random Count Not Announced to Staff- random count not being announced. Tim-I didn’t know that. I will look into it.
  11. Pexton Community Meetings- Hesse-staff concerned that they are forced to run meetings by themselves. Not experts and don’t feel trained nor are they the appropriate. Initiate training? Troy-it is set up that way. Someone that was put there with no experience. The supervisors have said there are some placed there who are. Some staff have sat in on some. Tim-let OD know if you don’t feel comfortable.
  12. Old Center Parking-Hesse-cant park there again? Reason? 3rd watch can’t utilize even though half empty. If other lots are full we have to park far away. Cold, slippery. How long till its noticed. Jaime-lighting isn’t good either. Tim-I firmly agree with you. There is only one lot here that has a sign. Stenger-we can look into it with forensics too. Hesse- guess if it was full but there are plenty. 
  13. Staff Searches- Hesse-more invasive searches empty pockets and bags. Why not brought here before implementation? Me personally but not here. Tim-that’s on me then, I thought I talked to you... to be on same page as Moose Lake. There’s is a little different. Everyone gets searched. If it’s a clear bag we don’t have to go through. We did it yesterday for everyone. It went well. No one upset, we had a homepage announcement. I apologize to not bring in here. Hesse-pill bottles empty? Tim-no, just talk to them about only bringing for day. Not a bottle with 1000 capsules. As is in policy. Hesse-worried about policy. Jaime-can we have ibuprofen in locker? Tim-not supposed to. Jaime-better than going home sick. Tim-bring in baggy. Jamie-unlabeled. Jaime-community ibuprofen. Tim-if we do a search then....Tim-only bring in what you need for the day. Two doses in case inversed. Hesse-when I was informed I was told supervisors only but still utilizing a team. Crystal-privacy if I don’t want people to know what I take. Hesse-same with phones. Yes, it does speak to professionalism. Tim-will bring that forward. I will let them know for only supervisors to be doing this.


Management Agenda Items

  1. Floating Holiday- Tim-January is when Jaime could start scheduling your floating holiday so please schedule them ASAP.

Adjourned at 110PM