February 2019 MSH Meet and Confer

AFSCME Labor Management MSH

February 21st 2019 1230PM

Administration Building


Attendance: Adam Castle, Matt Stenger, Marvin Sullivan, Crystal Kreklow, Emilio Florez, Kurt Crosby, Steve Wilking, Scott Melby, Lisa Vanderveen, Alli Kuhlman, Denise Considine, Michelle Chalin, Carol Olsen, Roxanne Portner


Reflection/Celebration: Marvin-employee appreciation went well. Carol-silent auction went very well. Physical Plant staff did a great job with this campus with all of the snow fall.

I want to say we had a good TSS class. Matt Letourneau was very engaging and had to do with the environment. Fantastic training class. Real life situations.

Standing Agenda Items:

  1. OSHA Information-Handouts from Alli.
  2. 2.      Overtime Information-Handouts from Alli.

Old Business:


  1. 1.      Update on dress code at the forensic Nursing home-Carol-will not allow hoods at the nursing home. Period.
  2. 2.      Follow up on Vacation requests on a day off-Roxanne-if you are not on site, send Jodi an email if you would like to request when not on campus. Carol-if you will be gone, send the email prior to leaving because home email may be filtered to junk mail. Kurt-if you can’t send an email, call as well.
  3. 3.      Update on partial shift vacation issue-Roxanne-Jodi thinks this is fixed. Marvin-still happening. But these are older requests. Maybe it’s fixed as of today. Roxanne-I think they fixed it and tested it. Ill ask to see if there are any issue. Carol-go to Jodi if you have any issues. Carol-did put out communication on campus. Roxanne-Increase vacation slots during the week and weekends stay the same. 3 during the week and only 2 can be LPNs. Will go into effect this next pay period. March 6th.
  4. 4.      Follow up on Staffing line sheet-Roxanne-Jodi said there already is a communication section. Marvin-when assigning people on unit and am an extra. It would shift off of unit to another so I won’t see it at all. I think this has been fixed.


  1. 1.      Radios policy update-Stenger-according to meeting the policy has been updated. Carol-updated as of yesterday and posted. Into effect march 6th. Emilio-some staff aren’t aware of the radio checks. Carol-Roessler was going to set up radio checks on a rotation as are as what days and units. Will be in place by March. In meantime do them as is. Radio in and master control responding.
  2. 2.      Organizational restructuring issues-Emilio-just wanted to see if there are any more updates. Carol-as I said in forums, how we are grouping the units and 5 separate groups. Who directors will be, etc. going through with NAS supervising nights. Hickory is starting to be engaged in off unit activities.
  3. 3.      Scheduling 6 months out vacation-Stenger-back to master language. Must include one day within the 6 months.

New Business:




  1. 1.      Elm Unit half door-Emilio-staff called us and we looked at it. Made a change to how desks are placed. Gap that you enter is straight shot to unit with no barrier. You have 3 patients with one staff. What will slow the patient down if they decide to enter? Asking for a half door placed in between the two desks. Doesn’t seem to be a lot of work and will make it safer for staff. Stenger-we brought this forward and staff that work there don’t like it. Staff that may have been there have bid out. Asking that we look at some other option. Some kind of barrier. Carol-I will be visiting. I will say I had lengthy conversation with the staff down there about the danger. Scott did also. They said this is how we want it. I get it, probably different staff. We tried to listen to staff.
  2. 2.      AODS Pool not calling out of building for overtime-Stenger-two issues. First is with overtime changing to offer out overtime for pay period. Overnights is asking a set time so they are awake to receive the phone calls. Suggestion was 8 to 9am to start making calls so they know they may have to stay up to accept overtime. Kurt-at least some uniformity. 2nd part is there has been an increase in inversing with AODS taking over sick calls. Our RNs did a valiant effort tot offer overtime. Since AODS took over we have seen a large increase in inverses. Kurt-contractually you don’t have to but I am curious. Causes a lot of people in the middle not getting calls. I was told they were instructed to follow contract language but some call out. Stenger-another option is that AOD pool can give it to rnod for call outs if they are busy. Carol-I want RN ODs to focus on RN duties. This was to take ODs away from just managing sick calls.  I want them to use RN skills, not sick time. Stenger-our RNs on hickory did a great job. It was always volunteer vs mandatory, now there has been an uptick. Scott-when we have time, we call out. One person at the time making the calls. We have more but not all there at one time. One person for needs of campus. Not only is OD addressing call ins, people calling for SNV, hot water system failures, maintenance for snow, etc. there are times we can’t call. We have talked about this for years. We will do it when we can. No change in direction. There are times we aren’t able to. Crystal-there are times we have had staff say they have been told “I don’t have to because it’s not contractual.” Scott-it’s inconsistent when we say “we will when we have time”. Crystal-but when you hear the message I don’t have to, that’s what causes the issue. Scott-and they are correct. But you have all of these things going on, and the OD may not have time to explain. We are doing the best we can. Kurt-staff understand but when they put there name down 2 hours before the shift is over. How is there not time? Scott, you have been a counselor, you know it throws a wrench into your life. Scott-there are active grievances on this. An OD has to make a decision. This case the OD made a decision. It’s better to tell a staff early so they can make arrangements. No matter what we do, someone isn’t going to be happy. when I say we will when we can, it will create inconsistency
  3. 3.      Members required to sit seclusion on willow unit/other options-Kurt-addressed at meeting. That we discussed this. Carol-make sure to call sod to call for additional staff if needed. Sods have never declined a staff.
  4. 4.      Workplace relations-Kurt-supposed to treat everyone with respect and dignity…be nice etc. be professional. Carol-yeah, be professional.
  5. 5.      FNH/RNs Floor Coverage-Kurt-staff talked to me where some wings are more difficult and they feel some staff are placed there more than RNs are. Is it the expectation to be scheduled equally? Michelle-Yeah.  Staff were told to call supervisor at home if had question how being scheduled. Kurt-were told there is a reason they are scheduled. Just want to have on record that. All staff are scheduled the same. Chalin-they are to work there as scheduled, not switch. Assignment is to rotate so not only certain people are on certain wings. Stenger-it was raised some RNs don’t want to work on the heavy wings. Michelle-ok, I got it. I don’t know but I will take it back.
  6. 6.      Management use of cell phone detector-Stenger-reported that management may be going around with detector. Cates concern if we are doing this, we need to have enough locker space for phones before implementation. With cold weather, you have to bring phones inside. Carol-I did some checking. Lockers aren’t being used. If we need more we can add. Steve-the locker lockers are being used but cell cubby holes are like crazy. We don’t see many people using the lockers. Smaller lockers are needed. Then ones with keys are being used. Bartlett only in back. Steve-not all have keys. Marvin-we hope you use the detector amongst all classifications. Carol-we aren’t using it all of the time, only when we suspect. Did full search on aspen. This is when we will use. If we do use it, it will be used for everyone. We want to protect our environment. Stenger-asking that if we enforce, we have a safe place to store it.
  7. 7.      ICS issues due to training process-Stenger-seen and heard on radios. The testing has decreased and wondering if it’s changing. Carol-I don’t know. Scott- we have a lot of new staff. When I reached out to the sups, they hadn’t had this concern. We are looking at improving the training on unused channel to get practice. Tom felt problems were more with staff initiating with just the unit name and no BIR being used. He has been trying to conduct more drills. People are avoiding him. We are working to increase drills for practice. Make sure we talk about concerns in debrief. Make sure we talk about these. If there are specifics, let Roessler know. We all need to take responsibility. I hear control doing a good job and asking what is needed. I’m looking for people to help us practice. Stenger-we had to test out in MSOP and there is no test out at MSH. Steve-when I was in MSOP you had to physical demonstrate. In MSH it’s if sup feels you are competent through questions as opposed to demonstration. Alli-test out means on your own? Steve-we brought it up before then fizzled out. Kind of getting strung along with the merger and everything else. But unless there isn’t a format, we are training them based on our own information. Training isn’t equal across the board which leaves inconsistency. Emilio-there was a checklist and just asking questions. Carol-sounds like this is broader orientation needed. Roxanne-is there a way to rate it also in debriefing. Carol-do people do a rich debriefing? Stenger-depends on situation. Scott-some people may feel vulnerable if they are new at it. Kurt-literally asking every person may be a good idea.
  8. 8.      Intermittent process-Stenger-several senior staff trying to get intermittent and see new staff hired as intermittent. Carol-new staff example? Scott-last one we hired john Sullivan and he is older than me. Steve-not in last couple months. Scott-I remember years ago we had a lot of overtime that people didn’t want. So, we hired people as intermittents. We currently have 13 and we don’t need anymore. We keep a list and there are 12 interested that are current staff. We want people who leave service to consider intermittents. Haven’t hired any as intermittent in forever. Carol-no one brand new but tapped into retirees. Scott-I get it but there is limited utility for us.
  9. 9.      Investigation numbers at FNH Increasing-Marvin-over last 4 or 5 months. Last minute notice on investigations is happening more also. Repetitive re interviewing subjects 2 or 3 times asking same questions or spinning them to get a different answer at nursing home specifically. I had to call the investigator out on spinning an answer. Curious why all of the sudden. Denise-I did look into this. Over the last year they are down from a year ago. I can’t speak to the repetitive interviews and we are really low actually. Emilio-there are a number that haven’t been sat yet. Steve-when you count them are there follow up? Denise-no, if people are brought in more than once I don’t have that. Stenger-they add something else to it and ask again. Steve-Marvin sat one, I sat one. They asked some of the same questions. Pulled someone in for basically one question. A 3rd was going to happen. This one person for 1 investigation for 3 interviews. Crystal-concern is pulling in for multiple and asking the same questions for same incident. Marvin-statement is they have new information and need answers. Then come back with same question asking differently. Stenger-it is the same investigator on these. Michelle-we need to do follow up. I will say that if I do have new information, I would come back with that and maybe it changes the answers because staff may not exactly know what was being asked. Emilio-it’s starting to look like “if I rephrase it, maybe ill get a different answer. Marvin-that’s what happened. The person asked “what time did you leave?” in both of the investigations. Carol-we will look into it. Stenger-puts undo stress on the staff. Roxanne-RNS trying to do non-subjects first so they have the facts first. Marvin-please give us more notice.

Add On:

  1. 1.      Willow patient off unit plan-Steve-at times is assaultive and has a plan. The plan is for staff to assess patient on unit and comes down to if he hits you, you can’t leave. If you speak to him and doesn’t hit you, you can leave. Why would we think it’s safe? Scott-assessment process for this patient. We have a scripted assessment such as questions of safety and what is plan. If he doesn’t pass, he doesn’t go. This plan implemented last Friday and hasn’t been any incidents since. Our work is complicated. If people want, I will do the assessment myself. We need to engage and not give him reason to assault. Kurt-staff concerned it is unpredictable. Scott-if he is agitated, he won’t go. Kurt-but still do the assessment? Scott-yes. I believe staff disagreed but not that they weren’t asked. Crystal-we are being told not talked to. Scott-best case is for staff to talk to the supervisors and tell them they don’t feel heard. Scott-a lot of times in my position I hear “we weren’t heard” but it’s that we didn’t go that direction.
  2. 2.      Stenger-LPN and RN still mutual if hours allow. Roxanne-the do similar work. We need to talk to man about this to see their concerns and bring it back. Crystal-can we get them together so we all hear the same conversation? Roxane-we can arrange that.
  3. 3.      Day on the hill-Stenger-any chance to get additional spots for day on the hill. We usually give list. Carol-get the list to HR. March 26th is Day on the Hill.


Adjourned at 145pm